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Back down to earth
#1
It's clear our great start to the season is over.  Teams have settled down, players have found their rhythm, games are beginning to get more serious.  Suddenly we're starting to look more like what we actually are -- a rebuilding team with a mostly rookie defence, gaping holes, and increasingly porous goaltending.  The only thing keeping us in games over the last week is the fact that, to most people's surprise, we can actually score goals.  This would not be the case without the additions of Max Domi and Tomas Tatar.  Even so, by the end of next week when we return from our Western Canada swing, we could well be out of a playoff spot, especially if Price continues to look as though he's forgotten -- and not for the first time -- everything he ever knew about goaltending.

The draft lottery may after all be within the realm of possibility.
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#2
Well, I hope it continues and I sure am enjoying watching the games (even the losses have been fun for the most part... infuriating, but entertaining) but I expected a struggle this season, and a 7th overall draft choice... not a Stanley Cup... so I'm not surprised by this lull nor am I going to get all wound up... I'm surprised by Domi and the hot start. I'll take the solace in that.
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#3
(2018-11-09, 10:20 AM)JF (BC) Wrote: It's clear our great start to the season is over.  Teams have settled down, players have found their rhythm, games are beginning to get more serious.  Suddenly we're starting to look more like what we actually are -- a rebuilding team with a mostly rookie defence, gaping holes, and increasingly porous goaltending.  The only thing keeping us in games over the last week is the fact that, to most people's surprise, we can actually score goals.  This would not be the case without the additions of Max Domi and Tomas Tatar.  Even so, by the end of next week when we return from our Western Canada swing, we could well be out of a playoff spot, especially if Price continues to look as though he's forgotten -- and not for the first time -- everything he ever knew about goaltending.

The draft lottery may after all be within the realm of possibility.
Not so sure about that Jane, last night was as Boone would say "not one for the DVD set" but 16 games in its our first time losing two in a row. I think its a little early.
º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤
Weed Wacker – and Flamethrower Grandma Smurf


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#4
Well sort of down to earth?

We r still ALOT BETTER then anyone thought we'd be scoring wise and with youth developing in NHL.

But as expected ....
Our D is still bad
Our PP is still bad
And Price, well last 2 games are suspect lol
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#5
(2018-11-09, 10:53 AM)Haba-daba-do Wrote: Well sort of down to earth?

We r still ALOT BETTER then anyone thought we'd be scoring wise and with youth developing in NHL.

But as expected ....
Our D is still bad
Our PP is still bad
And Price, well last 2 games are suspect lol
Agree Haba..I am hoping Weber returns soon and has an impact. It is a big load to expect Pitre to hold on to..
The PP for sure, if they had of capitalized on half the chances..
Price has admitted he has an issue that it half the battle, hopefully he figures it out..Nemi has proven to be a good back up, so what if Price takes a break and Nemi plays for a bit..as long as we win games..I don't care.  It would be interesting to see what would happen if he did play a bunch of games, we all thought Condon was this spectacular back up and when he was put in the #1 position it did not go so well.
º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤
Weed Wacker – and Flamethrower Grandma Smurf


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#6
(2018-11-09, 10:35 AM)Mavid Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 10:20 AM)JF (BC) Wrote: It's clear our great start to the season is over.  Teams have settled down, players have found their rhythm, games are beginning to get more serious.  Suddenly we're starting to look more like what we actually are -- a rebuilding team with a mostly rookie defence, gaping holes, and increasingly porous goaltending.  The only thing keeping us in games over the last week is the fact that, to most people's surprise, we can actually score goals.  This would not be the case without the additions of Max Domi and Tomas Tatar.  Even so, by the end of next week when we return from our Western Canada swing, we could well be out of a playoff spot, especially if Price continues to look as though he's forgotten -- and not for the first time -- everything he ever knew about goaltending.

The draft lottery may after all be within the realm of possibility.
Not so sure about that Jane, last night was as Boone would say "not one for the DVD set" but 16 games in its our first time losing two in a row. I think its a little early.

And we got a point, and probably deserved a point at MSG. These three point games keep a bunch of teams on the lottery/playoff border.
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#7
(2018-11-09, 10:53 AM)Haba-daba-do Wrote: Well sort of down to earth?

We r still ALOT BETTER then anyone thought we'd be scoring wise and with youth developing in NHL.

But as expected ....
Our D is still bad
Our PP is still bad
And Price, well last 2 games are suspect lol

Price has allowed 4 or more goals in each of his last 4 starts and is now sporting a GAA greater than 3 and a save percentage less than .900.

A few guys, Domi, Tatar, and Gallagher scoring considerably more than expected has helped this team stay above water but beyond those 3 the team has been as bad as expected.
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#8
Perhaps I'm being a bit premature, but the trend does not look good.  The defence has looked this whole road trip the way we all expected it to look at the beginning of the season and special teams, especially the power play, have been mostly horrible.  Weber's return will certainly help, but that is unlilkely to happen for at least a month.  And other injuries are starting to take their toll.  Byron is now week-to-week rather than day-to-day, and Armia will apparently miss at least six weeks.

On top of all this, it looks like we could have a goaltending problem.  Price's save percentage for the year is exactly where it was last year, and he's given up 19 goals in his last four games, with last night's game being his worst.  The evidence certainly seems to be mounting to suggest that he'll never again get even close to being as good as he was a few years ago.  In fact, according to RDS a couple of days ago, the sample size is now just over one hundred games -- going back, perhaps significantly, to that game against San Jose at the Bell Centre nearly two years ago, when he levelled the famous stare at Michel Therrien on his way back to the bench after being pulled.

The thing with Price is that this is by no means the first, or even the second time that he has suddenly seemed to lose all his resources, giving up handfuls of bad goals per game.  Everything is off -- positioning, puck-tracking, timing, judgment. And these periods of poor play have in his case lasted weeks or months rather than a mere couple of games.  So this could be our goaltending situation for a while, unless Julien turns to Antii Niemi.  And his failure to replace Price after two periods last night suggests he'll be reluctant to do this.
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#9
(2018-11-09, 11:22 AM)mada7 Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 10:53 AM)Haba-daba-do Wrote: Well sort of down to earth?

We r still ALOT BETTER then anyone thought we'd be scoring wise and with youth developing in NHL.

But as expected ....
Our D is still bad
Our PP is still bad
And Price, well last 2 games are suspect lol

Price has allowed 4 or more goals in each of his last 4 starts and is now sporting a GAA greater than 3 and a save percentage less than .900.

A few guys, Domi, Tatar, and Gallagher scoring considerably more than expected has helped this team stay above water but beyond those 3 the team has been as bad as expected.
Might be time for Lindgren to come back into the mix.

If Price doesn't get back on track in the next while, this will become Bergevin's Albatross, IMO.

If teams get a free buyout (Cap-wise) after the next lockout, it could lead to a double whammy -- team buys out Price and terminates Bergevin. Bergevin buying out Price and keeping his job in the process makes no sense.

That said, it might not be over yet for Price, despite what the most anti-Price might think.

As a friend said, if Price and the team get three extended playoff runs in the 8-yr contract, it's a win. If the team wins one Cup -- whichever year -- it's a Bonanza! If Price plays so-so all season long. but plays well in the playoffs those three times, who cares, really.

I don't disagree, as long as the supporting cast gives us entertaining hockey as they have so far this season, but we all know that giving an all out effort only to see a G waste it will eventually lead to less of an all out effort. It's human nature. There will be better players (youngsters) grafting themselves onto this lineup in the next couple of years and things could also be looking up, even with an average Carey Price getting unnecessarily  paid like a Superstar

Where I do worry is that I can't recall, other than the year Kreider took his knee out, Price stealing games come playoff time. The last playoffs where the NYRs eliminated us in the first round, I don't think Price can be blamed other than saying that he didn't play better than the other G, but the stats of that series do point to a dominant G performance, on a team that couldn't buy a goal to save it's life.

It's complicated with Price, as it has been for the Habs wth their Gs since 30-35 years go, when the team has gradually been more and more predicated on the G needing to be the team's #1 star and the rest of the players not needing to be stars.

Paying Price 10.5M a year certainly hasn't helped change the fans' perception of how management sees the future in respect to how to build a winner.

Honestly, Price at 6.5M like during his last contract, nobody has the type of hissy fit they are currently or will soon be having. However, there would be a lot more discussion about Lindgren or McNiven coming in to potentially steal the #1 G spot on this team.

Price's current Cap hit eliminates any outlook towards the future when it comes t the G position, but I don't think that it should, especially if Price doesn't buckle down and turn things around.

As an aside, helping by building a better overall D certainly wouldn't hurt in the short and medium term Happy
Ancient Chinese Proverb: A mosquito landing on your testicle should help you realize that violence doesn't solve every problem
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#10
(2018-11-09, 11:32 AM)JF (BC) Wrote: Perhaps I'm being a bit premature, but the trend does not look good.  The defence has looked this whole road trip the way we all expected it to look at the beginning of the season and special teams, especially the power play, have been mostly horrible.  Weber's return will certainly help, but that is unlilkely to happen for at least a month.  And other injuries are starting to take their toll.  Byron is now week-to-week rather than day-to-day, and Armia will apparently miss at least six weeks.

On top of all this, it looks like we could have a goaltending problem.  Price's save percentage for the year is exactly where it was last year, and he's given up 19 goals in his last four games, with last night's game being his worst.  The evidence certainly seems to be mounting to suggest that he'll never again get even close to being as good as he was a few years ago.  In fact, according to RDS a couple of days ago, the sample size is now just over one hundred games -- going back, perhaps significantly, to that game against San Jose at the Bell Centre nearly two years ago, when he levelled the famous stare at Michel Therrien on his way back to the bench after being pulled.

The thing with Price is that this is by no means the first, or even the second time that he has suddenly seemed to lose all his resources, giving up handfuls of bad goals per game.  Everything is off -- positioning, puck-tracking, timing, judgment. And these periods of poor play have in his case lasted weeks or months rather than a mere couple of games.  So this could be our goaltending situation for a while, unless Julien turns to Antii Niemi.  And his failure to replace Price after two periods last night suggests he'll be reluctant to do this.

I didn’t see any reason to pull him, I put the blame on an inept defensive corp that just let the Sabres camp out in his face, firing away. Now the OT goal was another thing but our Dmen were awful trying to defend.  We may have improved our mobility, but it does appear to be at the expense of defending in our own end. That Eichel, Skinner play off the face off was embarrassing, how the hell can Price stop that? And, how Beaulieu wasn’t called for interfering with Price was just a bad call, he put his stick right on the pad he was trying to kick out to make the stop.

I do beleive it will be a rough year for Price, and most other goalies as the league continues to look for ways to increase scoring, but it would be nice to see support on the backend.
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#11
(2018-11-09, 11:39 AM)Scriptor Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 11:22 AM)mada7 Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 10:53 AM)Haba-daba-do Wrote: Well sort of down to earth?

We r still ALOT BETTER then anyone thought we'd be scoring wise and with youth developing in NHL.

But as expected ....
Our D is still bad
Our PP is still bad
And Price, well last 2 games are suspect lol

Price has allowed 4 or more goals in each of his last 4 starts and is now sporting a GAA greater than 3 and a save percentage less than .900.

A few guys, Domi, Tatar, and Gallagher scoring considerably more than expected has helped this team stay above water but beyond those 3 the team has been as bad as expected.
Might be time for Lindgren to come back into the mix.

If Price doesn't get back on track in the next while, this will become Bergevin's Albatross, IMO.

If teams get a free buyout (Cap-wise) after the next lockout, it could lead to a double whammy -- team buys out Price and terminates Bergevin. Bergevin buying out Price and keeping his job in the process makes no sense.

That said, it might not be over yet for Price, despite what the most anti-Price might think.

As a friend said, if Price and the team get three extended playoff runs in the 8-yr contract, it's a win. If the team wins one Cup -- whichever year -- it's a Bonanza! If Price plays so-so all season long. but plays well in the playoffs those three times, who cares, really.

I don't disagree, as long as the supporting cast gives us entertaining hockey as they have so far this season, but we all know that giving an all out effort only to see a G waste it will eventually lead to less of an all out effort. It's human nature. There will be better players (youngsters) grafting themselves onto this lineup in the next couple of years and things could also be looking up, even with an average Carey Price getting unnecessarily  paid like a Superstar

Where I do worry is that I can't recall, other than the year Kreider took his knee out, Price stealing games come playoff time. The last playoffs where the NYRs eliminated us in the first round, I don't think Price can be blamed other than saying that he didn't play better than the other G, but the stats of that series do point to a dominant G performance, on a team that couldn't buy a goal to save it's life.

It's complicated with Price, as it has been for the Habs wth their Gs since 30-35 years go, when the team has gradually been more and more predicated on the G needing to be the team's #1 star and the rest of the players not needing to be stars.

Paying Price 10.5M a year certainly hasn't helped change the fans' perception of how management sees the future in respect to how to build a winner.

Honestly, Price at 6.5M like during his last contract, nobody has the type of hissy fit they are currently or will soon be having. However, there would be a lot more discussion about Lindgren or McNiven coming in to potentially steal the #1 G spot on this team.

Price's current Cap hit eliminates any outlook towards the future when it comes t the G position, but I don't think that it should, especially if Price doesn't buckle down and turn things around.

As an aside, helping by building a better overall D certainly wouldn't hurt in the short and medium term Happy

Historically, Price has been at his unstoppable best when returning from a gold medal/World Cup win. So much of a goalie’s game stems from confidence, and giving up 2 goals in seven games or whatever it was is extremely good for confidence. That effect snowballs until everyone—opposing shooters included—start to believe that scoring a goal on you will be next to impossible. That’s where Price was at two years ago.

Now, he has to find a way to work his way back there from zero, without the benefit of playing behind a world-class Olympian defence, and wearing equipment that is giving goalies across the league nervous breakdowns—all while carrying the burden of expectations that come with an outsized contract.

It’s not gonna be easy.

Most experts agree the Habs can’t make the playoffs without him. I’m not entirely convinced that’s true anymore, but it’s certainly hard to picture winning a cup with our franchise player warming the bench.
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#12
(2018-11-09, 11:39 AM)Scriptor Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 11:22 AM)mada7 Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 10:53 AM)Haba-daba-do Wrote: Well sort of down to earth?

We r still ALOT BETTER then anyone thought we'd be scoring wise and with youth developing in NHL.

But as expected ....
Our D is still bad
Our PP is still bad
And Price, well last 2 games are suspect lol

Price has allowed 4 or more goals in each of his last 4 starts and is now sporting a GAA greater than 3 and a save percentage less than .900.

A few guys, Domi, Tatar, and Gallagher scoring considerably more than expected has helped this team stay above water but beyond those 3 the team has been as bad as expected.
Might be time for Lindgren to come back into the mix.

If Price doesn't get back on track in the next while, this will become Bergevin's Albatross, IMO.

If teams get a free buyout (Cap-wise) after the next lockout, it could lead to a double whammy -- team buys out Price and terminates Bergevin. Bergevin buying out Price and keeping his job in the process makes no sense.

That said, it might not be over yet for Price, despite what the most anti-Price might think.

As a friend said, if Price and the team get three extended playoff runs in the 8-yr contract, it's a win. If the team wins one Cup -- whichever year -- it's a Bonanza! If Price plays so-so all season long. but plays well in the playoffs those three times, who cares, really.

I don't disagree, as long as the supporting cast gives us entertaining hockey as they have so far this season, but we all know that giving an all out effort only to see a G waste it will eventually lead to less of an all out effort. It's human nature. There will be better players (youngsters) grafting themselves onto this lineup in the next couple of years and things could also be looking up, even with an average Carey Price getting unnecessarily  paid like a Superstar

Where I do worry is that I can't recall, other than the year Kreider took his knee out, Price stealing games come playoff time. The last playoffs where the NYRs eliminated us in the first round, I don't think Price can be blamed other than saying that he didn't play better than the other G, but the stats of that series do point to a dominant G performance, on a team that couldn't buy a goal to save it's life.

It's complicated with Price, as it has been for the Habs wth their Gs since 30-35 years go, when the team has gradually been more and more predicated on the G needing to be the team's #1 star and the rest of the players not needing to be stars.

Paying Price 10.5M a year certainly hasn't helped change the fans' perception of how management sees the future in respect to how to build a winner.

Honestly, Price at 6.5M like during his last contract, nobody has the type of hissy fit they are currently or will soon be having. However, there would be a lot more discussion about Lindgren or McNiven coming in to potentially steal the #1 G spot on this team.

Price's current Cap hit eliminates any outlook towards the future when it comes t the G position, but I don't think that it should, especially if Price doesn't buckle down and turn things around.

As an aside, helping by building a better overall D certainly wouldn't hurt in the short and medium term Happy

The story parallels Luongo’s situation in Van, signing the best goalie (at the time) to a big, long term contract on a team that was regressing to a rebuild, Price is gonna wish he had played out his contract then looked around for his best options (salary and destination).  I have nothing against Price, but MB failed to realize the state of his team; strong goalie prospects, and a number of years from a competitive line up, meant trading Price at peak value to assist with a rebuild.
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#13
(2018-11-09, 12:09 PM)johnnylarue Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 11:39 AM)Scriptor Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 11:22 AM)mada7 Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 10:53 AM)Haba-daba-do Wrote: Well sort of down to earth?

We r still ALOT BETTER then anyone thought we'd be scoring wise and with youth developing in NHL.

But as expected ....
Our D is still bad
Our PP is still bad
And Price, well last 2 games are suspect lol

Price has allowed 4 or more goals in each of his last 4 starts and is now sporting a GAA greater than 3 and a save percentage less than .900.

A few guys, Domi, Tatar, and Gallagher scoring considerably more than expected has helped this team stay above water but beyond those 3 the team has been as bad as expected.
Might be time for Lindgren to come back into the mix.

If Price doesn't get back on track in the next while, this will become Bergevin's Albatross, IMO.

If teams get a free buyout (Cap-wise) after the next lockout, it could lead to a double whammy -- team buys out Price and terminates Bergevin. Bergevin buying out Price and keeping his job in the process makes no sense.

That said, it might not be over yet for Price, despite what the most anti-Price might think.

As a friend said, if Price and the team get three extended playoff runs in the 8-yr contract, it's a win. If the team wins one Cup -- whichever year -- it's a Bonanza! If Price plays so-so all season long. but plays well in the playoffs those three times, who cares, really.

I don't disagree, as long as the supporting cast gives us entertaining hockey as they have so far this season, but we all know that giving an all out effort only to see a G waste it will eventually lead to less of an all out effort. It's human nature. There will be better players (youngsters) grafting themselves onto this lineup in the next couple of years and things could also be looking up, even with an average Carey Price getting unnecessarily  paid like a Superstar

Where I do worry is that I can't recall, other than the year Kreider took his knee out, Price stealing games come playoff time. The last playoffs where the NYRs eliminated us in the first round, I don't think Price can be blamed other than saying that he didn't play better than the other G, but the stats of that series do point to a dominant G performance, on a team that couldn't buy a goal to save it's life.

It's complicated with Price, as it has been for the Habs wth their Gs since 30-35 years go, when the team has gradually been more and more predicated on the G needing to be the team's #1 star and the rest of the players not needing to be stars.

Paying Price 10.5M a year certainly hasn't helped change the fans' perception of how management sees the future in respect to how to build a winner.

Honestly, Price at 6.5M like during his last contract, nobody has the type of hissy fit they are currently or will soon be having. However, there would be a lot more discussion about Lindgren or McNiven coming in to potentially steal the #1 G spot on this team.

Price's current Cap hit eliminates any outlook towards the future when it comes t the G position, but I don't think that it should, especially if Price doesn't buckle down and turn things around.

As an aside, helping by building a better overall D certainly wouldn't hurt in the short and medium term Happy

Historically, Price has been at his unstoppable best when returning from a gold medal/World Cup win. So much of a goalie’s game stems from confidence, and giving up 2 goals in seven games or whatever it was is extremely good for confidence. That effect snowballs until everyone—opposing shooters included—start to believe that scoring a goal on you will be next to impossible. That’s where Price was at two years ago.

Now, he has to find a way to work his way back there from zero, without the benefit of playing behind a world-class Olympian defence, and wearing equipment that is giving goalies across the league nervous breakdowns—all while carrying the burden of expectations that come with an outsized contract.

It’s not gonna be easy.

Most experts agree the Habs can’t make the playoffs without him. I’m not entirely convinced that’s true anymore, but it’s certainly hard to picture winning a cup with our franchise player warming the bench.

The days of franchise players being the goalie are long gone, the ice is slanted against them. If we look at recent past Cup winners, their goalie situations are up and down, just ask Fleury and Murray.
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#14
(2018-11-09, 12:29 PM)Habcertain Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 12:09 PM)johnnylarue Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 11:39 AM)Scriptor Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 11:22 AM)mada7 Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 10:53 AM)Haba-daba-do Wrote: Well sort of down to earth?

We r still ALOT BETTER then anyone thought we'd be scoring wise and with youth developing in NHL.

But as expected ....
Our D is still bad
Our PP is still bad
And Price, well last 2 games are suspect lol

Price has allowed 4 or more goals in each of his last 4 starts and is now sporting a GAA greater than 3 and a save percentage less than .900.

A few guys, Domi, Tatar, and Gallagher scoring considerably more than expected has helped this team stay above water but beyond those 3 the team has been as bad as expected.
Might be time for Lindgren to come back into the mix.

If Price doesn't get back on track in the next while, this will become Bergevin's Albatross, IMO.

If teams get a free buyout (Cap-wise) after the next lockout, it could lead to a double whammy -- team buys out Price and terminates Bergevin. Bergevin buying out Price and keeping his job in the process makes no sense.

That said, it might not be over yet for Price, despite what the most anti-Price might think.

As a friend said, if Price and the team get three extended playoff runs in the 8-yr contract, it's a win. If the team wins one Cup -- whichever year -- it's a Bonanza! If Price plays so-so all season long. but plays well in the playoffs those three times, who cares, really.

I don't disagree, as long as the supporting cast gives us entertaining hockey as they have so far this season, but we all know that giving an all out effort only to see a G waste it will eventually lead to less of an all out effort. It's human nature. There will be better players (youngsters) grafting themselves onto this lineup in the next couple of years and things could also be looking up, even with an average Carey Price getting unnecessarily  paid like a Superstar

Where I do worry is that I can't recall, other than the year Kreider took his knee out, Price stealing games come playoff time. The last playoffs where the NYRs eliminated us in the first round, I don't think Price can be blamed other than saying that he didn't play better than the other G, but the stats of that series do point to a dominant G performance, on a team that couldn't buy a goal to save it's life.

It's complicated with Price, as it has been for the Habs wth their Gs since 30-35 years go, when the team has gradually been more and more predicated on the G needing to be the team's #1 star and the rest of the players not needing to be stars.

Paying Price 10.5M a year certainly hasn't helped change the fans' perception of how management sees the future in respect to how to build a winner.

Honestly, Price at 6.5M like during his last contract, nobody has the type of hissy fit they are currently or will soon be having. However, there would be a lot more discussion about Lindgren or McNiven coming in to potentially steal the #1 G spot on this team.

Price's current Cap hit eliminates any outlook towards the future when it comes t the G position, but I don't think that it should, especially if Price doesn't buckle down and turn things around.

As an aside, helping by building a better overall D certainly wouldn't hurt in the short and medium term Happy

Historically, Price has been at his unstoppable best when returning from a gold medal/World Cup win. So much of a goalie’s game stems from confidence, and giving up 2 goals in seven games or whatever it was is extremely good for confidence. That effect snowballs until everyone—opposing shooters included—start to believe that scoring a goal on you will be next to impossible. That’s where Price was at two years ago.

Now, he has to find a way to work his way back there from zero, without the benefit of playing behind a world-class Olympian defence, and wearing equipment that is giving goalies across the league nervous breakdowns—all while carrying the burden of expectations that come with an outsized contract.

It’s not gonna be easy.

Most experts agree the Habs can’t make the playoffs without him. I’m not entirely convinced that’s true anymore, but it’s certainly hard to picture winning a cup with our franchise player warming the bench.

The days of franchise players being the goalie are long gone, the ice is slanted against them. If we look at recent past Cup winners, their goalie situations are up and down, just ask Fleury and Murray.

In that regard, Bergevin appears to be well behind the curve yet again -- he reacts rather than acts (and rarely smartly), in RN's parlance.

Price's contract, both dollars and term, can in effect prevent the rise of other goaltenders in the system, even if they prove to be better than what Price has become and at a much better cap hit. 

Then there's the optics of the highest-paid, "franchise" player soiling the bed. Not the branding the team wants, nor helpful to the "attitude" on a team where the other players aren't oblivious to the situation.
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#15
Price's contract size won't prevent the rise of another G, if management and coaching have agreed that another G is the best option going forward, but the term, I agree, will make things more difficult as that younger G starts earning bigger money with a new contract and another... By then, though, Price will be at the tail end of his contract and buying him out would only mean continuing to pay a total like Price was in nets (counting the 6M - 7M that the younger G would now be earning, if he was that good), only with a younger and, hopefully, better G taking the minutes instead.

Buying 2 years of Price's contract out at the end of his current contract and after our next G's bridge contract would mean a 3.5M Cap hit for four years. By then, four years of 3.5M won't really affect the team's overall Cap hit, IMO, not enough to prevent us from icing a strong and deep lineup.

3.5M on a likely 90M total Cap -- or more -- won't mean squat.
Ancient Chinese Proverb: A mosquito landing on your testicle should help you realize that violence doesn't solve every problem
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#16
(2018-11-09, 01:57 PM)Scriptor Wrote: Price's contract size won't prevent the rise of another G, if management and coaching have agreed that another G is the best option going forward, but the term, I agree, will make things more difficult as that younger G starts earning bigger money with a new contract and another...  By then, though, Price will be at the tail end of his contract and buying him out would only mean continuing to pay a total like Price was in nets (counting the 6M - 7M that the younger G would now be earning, if he was that good), only with a younger and, hopefully, better G taking the minutes instead.

Buying 2 years of Price's contract out at the end of his current contract and after our next G's bridge contract would mean a 3.5M Cap hit for four years. By then, four years of 3.5M won't really affect the team's overall Cap hit, IMO, not enough to prevent us from icing a strong and deep lineup.

3.5M on a likely 90M total Cap -- or more -- won't mean squat.

If management opts for old-school thinking -- i.e. playing vets and keeping the "kids" in the minors or on the bench -- and Price keeps his job no matter what, there could be no room for the guys in the system. That's how you end up trading away prospects, giving them a chance to play elsewhere. Not saying that's the case here, but Price's reputation, the large contract and even Bergevin's ego could all play significant parts in determining if the younger netminders get a shot.

In other words, under what circumstances does Price get Murray-ed in the way Fleury did, for instance? 
Moved to backup? Shipped out? 

All hypothetical if Price finds his game, meaning his historical "good" play, not necessarily his one-season dominance, though that would be great.
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#17
(2018-11-09, 03:13 PM)Habituated Wrote:
(2018-11-09, 01:57 PM)Scriptor Wrote: Price's contract size won't prevent the rise of another G, if management and coaching have agreed that another G is the best option going forward, but the term, I agree, will make things more difficult as that younger G starts earning bigger money with a new contract and another...  By then, though, Price will be at the tail end of his contract and buying him out would only mean continuing to pay a total like Price was in nets (counting the 6M - 7M that the younger G would now be earning, if he was that good), only with a younger and, hopefully, better G taking the minutes instead.

Buying 2 years of Price's contract out at the end of his current contract and after our next G's bridge contract would mean a 3.5M Cap hit for four years. By then, four years of 3.5M won't really affect the team's overall Cap hit, IMO, not enough to prevent us from icing a strong and deep lineup.

3.5M on a likely 90M total Cap -- or more -- won't mean squat.

If management opts for old-school thinking -- i.e. playing vets and keeping the "kids" in the minors or on the bench -- and Price keeps his job no matter what, there could be no room for the guys in the system. That's how you end up trading away prospects, giving them a chance to play elsewhere. Not saying that's the case here, but Price's reputation, the large contract and even Bergevin's ego could all play significant parts in determining if the younger netminders get a shot.

In other words, under what circumstances does Price get Murray-ed in the way Fleury did, for instance? 
Moved to backup? Shipped out? 

All hypothetical if Price finds his game, meaning his historical "good" play, not necessarily his one-season dominance, though that would be great.

Price to Vancouver could eventually work out, if he started to show a semblance of himself.

Canucks are on the upswing, though their defence is currently shyte (Hughes and Juolevi on the way) and their goaltending blows. B.C. boy comes home would be quite a coup. Might even make him less tired.

We'd have to eat Loui Eriksson's hideous contract coming back, but Price for Demko, Eriksson and a middling pick would genuinely change our culture. #penniesonthedollar

Cheap, potential No. 1G in the system. Niemi holds down the fort. Geoffie buys out Little Things Loui. Young, fast and new identity continues.

LTCA is admitted to hospital for dehydration after massive spontaneous orgasm.
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#18
He'll get amnesty bought out at the next CBA. Write it down. Bergie might be gone by then and the next GM won't have to protect the signing to make it look better. So gonzo. Off to mainline on Vitamin B12 shots and slurp down cold refreshing ayahuascas.
The MB Trifecta: Low Cost, Low Risk, No Return
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#19
(2018-11-09, 05:24 PM)Captain aHab Wrote: He'll get amnesty bought out at the next CBA. Write it down. Bergie might be gone by then and the next GM won't have to protect the signing to make it look better. So gonzo. Off to mainline on Vitamin B12 shots and slurp down cold refreshing ayahuascas.

I wouldn't assume there necessarily will be amnesty buyouts in the next CBA. The last two had them because in the most recent one they had to radically cut the cap because of all the cap circumventing contracts that allowed contracts to grow to silly sizes getting outlawed and the one before that because it introduced a cap in the first place. The league is in a relatively good place at the moment in terms of where the cap is at so it's unlikely that the cap will need to be radically adjusted again thus no amnesty buyouts. Not saying it definitely won't happen (as I have no idea what the labor status actually is in the NHL) I'm just saying we shouldn't assume it will happen
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#20
(2018-11-09, 05:24 PM)Captain aHab Wrote: He'll get amnesty bought out at the next CBA. Write it down. Bergie might be gone by then and the next GM won't have to protect the signing to make it look better. So gonzo. Off to mainline on Vitamin B12 shots and slurp down cold refreshing ayahuascas.

there have been a number of references here to Bergevin getting some kind of 'do-over' using a compliance buyout down the road

as Mada says there is no guarantee

and in fact it is unlikely

to find out why - it is somewhat technical - Google is your friend
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