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Rogers + Shapiro +Atkins may have misjudged
#21
I had season tickets (actually a "blue jays fan pass", which gave me every home game except the home opener + July 1st for $99 a season) with them for 4 seasons leading up to their 2015 playoff year. Then they made the playoffs once, and cancelled the fan pass program, and tried to sell me on "flex-packs" that cost 2-4X what I had been paying, except for only 12-20 games access instead of the 79 games access I'd previously had.

So they wanted me to pay 2-4X MORE $$ for ~75-85% fewer games. I understand supply/demand changed, but still, that's an absolute ridiculous increase.
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#22
(2016-12-12, 10:33 PM)shadylane Wrote: And SNLeafaholic, I don't mean to criticize you specifically, but it irks me to see the sentiment amongst the fan base that support will come only when the team is good. That's the definition of a fair weather fan to me and unfortunately there are a hell of a lot of them in Toronto.

To be fair that's what you get with 22 years of no playoff appearances.
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#23
(2016-12-14, 02:55 PM)tmleafer Wrote: I had season tickets (actually a "blue jays fan pass", which gave me every home game except the home opener + July 1st for $99 a season) with them for 4 seasons leading up to their 2015 playoff year. Then they made the playoffs once, and cancelled the fan pass program, and tried to sell me on "flex-packs" that cost 2-4X what I had been paying, except for only 12-20 games access instead of the 79 games access I'd previously had.

So they wanted me to pay 2-4X MORE $$ for ~75-85% fewer games. I understand supply/demand changed, but still, that's an absolute ridiculous increase.

They only needed you during the lean years.  TFC did the same thing with my seasons tickets, I told them to blow it out their ear.
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#24
(2016-12-14, 04:20 PM)Lumbergh Wrote:
(2016-12-14, 02:55 PM)tmleafer Wrote: I had season tickets (actually a "blue jays fan pass", which gave me every home game except the home opener + July 1st for $99 a season) with them for 4 seasons leading up to their 2015 playoff year. Then they made the playoffs once, and cancelled the fan pass program, and tried to sell me on "flex-packs" that cost 2-4X what I had been paying, except for only 12-20 games access instead of the 79 games access I'd previously had.

So they wanted me to pay 2-4X MORE $$ for ~75-85% fewer games. I understand supply/demand changed, but still, that's an absolute ridiculous increase.

They only needed you during the lean years.  TFC did the same thing with my seasons tickets, I told them to blow it out their ear.

Was pretty disappointing. I expected an increase in price, but figured it'd be a ~25% increase or something like that, heck maybe even 50%. Instead to get the equivalent package that I did have (1st base line 500 level tickets to 79 games of the season) would be ~$1,250 for season tickets in that section. That's ~12.5X more expensive lol. Like holy crap, way to drive away some of your more dedicated fans. 

When they go back to being a consistent non-playoff team, attendance drops, and they're out seeking anyone they can to fill the seats, I wouldn't be interested anymore. I cheer for the team, but have no interest in lining Rogers pockets. Granted, I moved back to Ottawa, so couldn't buy tickets anymore even if I wanted to!
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#25
you are complaining about having to pay 15 bucks a game?

how realistic is it to expect them to keep selling tickets for under 2 dollars a game, when games are in demand now....as opposed to when they had those passes, and attendance would rarely top 20K?
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#26
Weren't those tickets tmleafer had also called The Toronto Star package? I remember those. I think at one point they were even less than $99. This is maybe going back a few years.

I'm not surprised in the slightest they stopped selling them. That's the kind of price point that Canadian hockey fans routinely ridicule southern American NHL markets for.

If you essentially have to give away tickets for free then I question the dedication of the fan base.
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#27
Toronto to baseball is like hockey in Pheonix, win they show up, lose forget it, watch it on tv, lol!
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#28
(2016-12-14, 07:36 PM)tmleafer Wrote:  I cheer for the team, but have no interest in lining Rogers pockets. 

You realize that Rogers probably makes very little money off Jays fans's, right?  The gate receipts for 2015 were $59 million. That would only pay about a third of the player payroll. In fact the Jays have one of the lowest revenue per fan numbers in MLB at $28 per fan ( Source )

It is also kind of funny that in a thread criticizing Rogers you also have people saying that they don't want to support the team financially by buying tickets (which are actally below the MLB avg price).So basically you want them to spend money and field a competitive team, but you don't want to help pay for said team or support them in any meaningful way. lol.
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#29
TV revenue Andrew... you forgot about that!

I like the direction that Shapiro & Atkins is taking the team.
Some fans would have them re-signing Bautsta, Price an Encarnacion for a combined 90 million per season.
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#30
Yeah, there's no way the front office could've done that. Maybe they could've invested a little more into another kick at the can but 2/3 of payroll can't be tied up in guys all in their mid-30s. The 2012 Phillies found that out the hard way. At least they had an earlier Championship to show for it.
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#31
(2016-12-15, 06:58 PM)Andrew Wrote:
(2016-12-14, 07:36 PM)tmleafer Wrote:  I cheer for the team, but have no interest in lining Rogers pockets.

It is also kind of funny that in a thread criticizing Rogers you also have people saying that they don't want to support the team financially by buying tickets (which are actally below the MLB avg price).So basically you want them to spend money and field a competitive team, but you don't want to help pay for said team or support them in any meaningful way. lol.

Yeah Ottawa Senator fans can't seem to figure this out either. It's a self-serving argument.

And I admit that if the team isn't good, I am less likely to pay attention to them and it's very unlikely I am going to more than a handful of games per year. I was going to 2 or 3 a season then July 2015 and happened and I have been to 40+ games since.

Ownership and management can spend their money any way they want. Their job is to put a good and exciting team on the field. It doesn't have to have an enormous payroll, but it does require identifying where you can and should spend money to put together the best organization they can - I think EE is a good example of that at this point. But Fowler, Chapman and Heyward are not (kinda ironic I list 3 champions though, lol).
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#32
In fairness to the fan base the Dome is not a great venue to see a game from. If the roof is closed and the crowd is sparse, it doesn't even have a major league atmosphere IMO. To enjoy a Tuesday start in April against the Rays with a mediocre starter on the mound (see: 2009 Blue Jays) really requires you to love the game of baseball.
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#33
(2016-12-15, 08:37 PM)lillypad_33 Wrote: TV revenue Andrew... you forgot about that!

The tv revenue comes from Rogers though.
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#34
(2016-12-16, 03:31 PM)Andrew Wrote:
(2016-12-15, 08:37 PM)lillypad_33 Wrote: TV revenue Andrew... you forgot about that!

The tv revenue comes from Rogers though.

Just wondering. Doesn't Major League Baseball dole out from a pot of revenues from all tv and as Rogers owns the team here along with the media that carries so don't they get monies from both?
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#35
(2016-12-11, 06:17 PM)Andrew Wrote: Man, Jays fans are just the worst.

How dare people be concerned after losing two sluggers and their team only making one signing of importance so far... lol. 

Considering our window is small and the Bosox and Yankees will be dominant again before long, the time to go for broke is now. The last two playoff runs have been an amazing experience, no doubt. But this team has (had?) the potential to win it all if the right moves were made. If they can't capitalize on the roster they have in the near future, God knows how long it'll be until we get back to this point again.

Your team got their World Series after a long run of futility... we haven't yet. And we want it.
We live to survive our paradoxes
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#36
My feeling is that Shapiro and Atkins (Shatkins?) know that this core had their kick at the can and it's not the time to saddle future rosters with massive contracts for players into their mid-30s just for one last shot. If they were 1 piece away? Sure, you definitely do it. A $25M 5-year contract for a veteran is a risk worth taking if that's all you need. But the core players like Donaldson, Tulo, Martin, Travis and Pillar have probably already peaked. There's more downside to this group than upside.

The last two years have been kind of bittersweet for me. It's been awesome seeing them in the postseason again finally but the window was always going to be a super short one. Now they'll probably have to take a step back before returning to contender status.

There is still a scenario where certain guys preform well in 2017 and they make the WC again of course. I'm not totally devoid of hope.
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#37
I think it's a stretch to say Travis and Pillar have peaked. Even Donaldson certainly isn't a guy I'd say is on the downside of his career.

At this point Edwin can probably be had on a two-year deal... virtually no risk in that.
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#38
(2016-12-17, 10:02 PM)lewis94 Wrote: I think it's a stretch to say Travis and Pillar have peaked. Even Donaldson certainly isn't a guy I'd say is on the downside of his career.

At this point Edwin can probably be had on a two-year deal... virtually no risk in that.

I think EE is more likely to sign a 1 year deal than a 2. Get back on the market next year with a better understanding of the market. He definitely doesn't want to be hitting the market after the 2018 season.
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#39
Pillar is Pillar...what we have got in the past, will likely continue. I don't expect an offensive breakout, but he he shouldn't decline yet either.

Travis is a healthy season away from breaking out. Every time we get a glimpse of what he can do, he gets hurt. Hard to maintain consistency when you are missing months at a time. He'll be 26 next year. Can't say he has "peaked" quite yet. Next year won't exactly be make or break for him, but hopefully with some health we can see what he can really do.
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#40
(2016-12-17, 06:40 PM)lewis94 Wrote:
(2016-12-11, 06:17 PM)Andrew Wrote: Man, Jays fans are just the worst.

How dare people be concerned after losing two sluggers and their team only making one signing of importance so far... lol. 

If the were truly concerned then they would bother to learn about the team (and the league) and not make ridiculous statements like this in the first place.


This thread is the same "Rogers is cheap! Rogers is screwing the fans!" bullshit that Jay's fans have cried about for 10 years. Any objective person though can see that it is not even close to reality which just makes threads like this seem like spoiled, clueless whining.
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