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The post-Karlsson trade thread
#41
(2018-09-14, 12:37 PM)Ryu65 Wrote: Seriously guys, not to stomp on the discussions at hand obviously but I would really like to know what you guys think about the lineup on opening day. The past 2 years of my life have been so busy with my new business I havent had a chance to really get I to the team and it coincides with them sucking so it made it worse.

For the first time in years I had to actually look up our roster online just to be able to put together a lineup. I dont even know half the guys on the roster right now I dont know who's a rookie or who was brought in through trades or signed as a free agent.

Do they rush Tkachuk? Does Wolanin make the team full time from camp? Is Colin White a "bust"? What about Formenton and Chlapik?

I feel like we just went through a rebuild a few seasons ago when Hoffman and Stone made the team and now again without any success in between.

To be perfectly frank, it's laughable.
I wouldn't rush Tkachuk at all. I wouldn't rush anyone into that dumpster fire.
The only hope for this team is a move downtown and a sale to a competent owner.

I hope you don't hand Colorado the best odds of FOA, but it looks like you're going to.
I feel bad for Andersen, he will probably get injured from all the pucks.
O' for a good life, we just might have to weaken
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#42
(2018-09-14, 12:55 PM)duediligence Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:51 AM)venison_casserole Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:45 AM)Chip Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:12 AM)RyeRocks Wrote: I always want my team to win

Especially when you don't hold your first round draft pick.
Settle in boys going to be 3-5 years of pain, much like we felt in Toronto.

no it will be longer.

When Toronto decided it was time for a re-build, they hired a competent GM and VP of HO. They strengthened their farm system. They drafted wisely, they got a coach that works well with young players, they dropped pretty much all their crap contracts. They made sure their scouting was on par and they invested in player development.

Ottawa has done none of those things.

Toronto bought their way out out of alot of problems. Something the Sens cant do.
New owners maybe could?

Dare to dream... LOL this takes me back.
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#43
(2018-09-14, 01:02 PM)FashionPolice Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 12:55 PM)duediligence Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:51 AM)venison_casserole Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:45 AM)Chip Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:12 AM)RyeRocks Wrote: I always want my team to win

Especially when you don't hold your first round draft pick.
Settle in boys going to be 3-5 years of pain, much like we felt in Toronto.

no it will be longer.

When Toronto decided it was time for a re-build, they hired a competent GM and VP of HO. They strengthened their farm system. They drafted wisely, they got a coach that works well with young players, they dropped pretty much all their crap contracts. They made sure their scouting was on par and they invested in player development.

Ottawa has done none of those things.

Toronto bought their way out out of alot of problems. Something the Sens cant do.
New owners maybe could?

Dare to dream... LOL this takes me back.

We can still do what we did with Gaborik, take on contracts where the actual salary may have been paid but the caphit is a pain. Lets us have roster plugs and make it look like we're icing a competitive team. Only thing is, Dorion needs to get some good assets like high picks or B level prospects if he's going to do that.
If you need a sign to stay alive tonight, this is it!
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#44
(2018-09-14, 12:37 PM)Ryu65 Wrote: Seriously guys, not to stomp on the discussions at hand obviously but I would really like to know what you guys think about the lineup on opening day. The past 2 years of my life have been so busy with my new business I havent had a chance to really get I to the team and it coincides with them sucking so it made it worse.

For the first time in years I had to actually look up our roster online just to be able to put together a lineup. I dont even know half the guys on the roster right now I dont know who's a rookie or who was brought in through trades or signed as a free agent.

Do they rush Tkachuk? Does Wolanin make the team full time from camp? Is Colin White a "bust"? What about Formenton and Chlapik?

I feel like we just went through a rebuild a few seasons ago when Hoffman and Stone made the team and now again without any success in between.

Formenton and Chlapik will be pressured to perform at a high level, but if they aren't regulars in the lineup I'll be disappointed in their development. Even if its 3rd line minutes, they need to be playing in the big club imo.

Wolanin is most definitely goung to be rushed, he'll be playing second pairing minutes and thrown to the wolves.

White isn't a bust, it'll take time to develop him but the Sens better not do to him what they did with Lazar.

Tkachuck is gonna be on the opening night roster. He'll be marketed as the next star
If you need a sign to stay alive tonight, this is it!
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#45
(2018-09-14, 01:02 PM)FashionPolice Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 12:55 PM)duediligence Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:51 AM)venison_casserole Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:45 AM)Chip Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:12 AM)RyeRocks Wrote: I always want my team to win

Especially when you don't hold your first round draft pick.
Settle in boys going to be 3-5 years of pain, much like we felt in Toronto.

no it will be longer.

When Toronto decided it was time for a re-build, they hired a competent GM and VP of HO. They strengthened their farm system. They drafted wisely, they got a coach that works well with young players, they dropped pretty much all their crap contracts. They made sure their scouting was on par and they invested in player development.

Ottawa has done none of those things.

Toronto bought their way out out of alot of problems. Something the Sens cant do.
New owners maybe could?

Dare to dream... LOL this takes me back.

The Leafs haven't proven anything it's all just speculation right now.  This isn't the first time the Leafs were supposed to have done a better job than Ottawa at building a team and then face flopping.  This isn't the first time Sens fans thought the sky is falling and the team wound up in the playoffs.

Rye, good idea and looking at the roster my opinion is this team has the potential to be like the teams that made the playoffs in 97 and 98 if they buy into Boucher's system.  Something that press has suggested the team didn't do last year thanks to Karlsson and now that distraction is gone.

The defence on paper is scary but Jacques got a lot out of mediocre D and two way depth forwards I believe Boucher is a similar coach.  Ultimately, it'll be up to the coach to win over the room and hope Anderson has a couple of years left.
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#46
That means, btw, I don't think Ottawa is a contender anytime soon just it isn't the end of the world
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#47
(2018-09-14, 09:11 AM)zapzac Wrote: You guys are rebuilding, do you really want them to be decent this year?

If they'd kept their 1st round pick for 2019 they probably could've tolerated finishing last this year

This season's probably going to be a rough, 'slow burn' kind of season in the Nation's Capital.
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#48
(2018-09-14, 11:48 AM)FormalWare Wrote: I can't imagine what it must feel like to be a Senators fan, right now. Your team was pretty good, not that long ago (and a bit of a nemesis for my Habs). Now they're an early favourite in the race for high draft lottery percentages - and they traded next year's first rounder!

Yikes.

They were an OT goal away from playing in the 2017 Stanley Cup Final.

Which makes their downfall since then look even more sudden & bizarre.
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#49
(2018-09-14, 02:08 PM)Rinkrat Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 01:02 PM)FashionPolice Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 12:55 PM)duediligence Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:51 AM)venison_casserole Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:45 AM)Chip Wrote: Especially when you don't hold your first round draft pick.
Settle in boys going to be 3-5 years of pain, much like we felt in Toronto.

no it will be longer.

When Toronto decided it was time for a re-build, they hired a competent GM and VP of HO. They strengthened their farm system. They drafted wisely, they got a coach that works well with young players, they dropped pretty much all their crap contracts. They made sure their scouting was on par and they invested in player development.

Ottawa has done none of those things.

Toronto bought their way out out of alot of problems. Something the Sens cant do.
New owners maybe could?

Dare to dream... LOL this takes me back.

The Leafs haven't proven anything it's all just speculation right now.  This isn't the first time the Leafs were supposed to have done a better job than Ottawa at building a team and then face flopping.  This isn't the first time Sens fans thought the sky is falling and the team wound up in the playoffs.

Rye, good idea and looking at the roster my opinion is this team has the potential to be like the teams that made the playoffs in 97 and 98 if they buy into Boucher's system.  Something that press has suggested the team didn't do last year thanks to Karlsson and now that distraction is gone.

The defence on paper is scary but Jacques got a lot out of mediocre D and two way depth forwards I believe Boucher is a similar coach.  Ultimately, it'll be up to the coach to win over the room and hope Anderson has a couple of years left.

There's no way Karlsson was a part of the problem. Especially when our goalies were so shite and players lile Ryan continue to underperform
If you need a sign to stay alive tonight, this is it!
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#50
This is a bottom five team at this point. That's your post Karlsson outlook
.
Its going to be ugly and I have no faith in the front office at this moment to turn it around any time soon.

Dorion has proven to be totally incompetent at his job.
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#51
You know what, I'm going to wait and see. Crazier things have happened, and let's be honest although Karlsson was the heart and soul of this team he was depended on way too much. He was always looked upon to lead the way both offensively and defensively and if he had an off night so did the whole team. I'm starting to think that now that he's gone it's going to be a bit of a wake up to the rest of the team; there's no more waiting around for Karlsson to save the day it's up to the players to step up as a cohesive unit and make it happen.

I still think our offense will be fine, let's be honest Ryan is due for at least one big year with us and if there's any good time to do it it's now. Duchene will put up points as will Stone, and guys like Dzingel, Tierny and Boedker will fill in some secondary scoring nicely.

My real concern is that defense. My goodness something has to be done before opening day because otherwise not even the best offense in the league could win games with a back-end support like that.
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#52
Yeah, we're talking coach of the year if Boucher has any success with that defense. It is my biggest worry when trying to be optimistic.
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#53
(2018-09-14, 06:28 PM)bicboi Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 02:08 PM)Rinkrat Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 01:02 PM)FashionPolice Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 12:55 PM)duediligence Wrote:
(2018-09-14, 09:51 AM)venison_casserole Wrote: no it will be longer.

When Toronto decided it was time for a re-build, they hired a competent GM and VP of HO. They strengthened their farm system. They drafted wisely, they got a coach that works well with young players, they dropped pretty much all their crap contracts. They made sure their scouting was on par and they invested in player development.

Ottawa has done none of those things.

Toronto bought their way out out of alot of problems. Something the Sens cant do.
New owners maybe could?

Dare to dream... LOL this takes me back.

The Leafs haven't proven anything it's all just speculation right now.  This isn't the first time the Leafs were supposed to have done a better job than Ottawa at building a team and then face flopping.  This isn't the first time Sens fans thought the sky is falling and the team wound up in the playoffs.

Rye, good idea and looking at the roster my opinion is this team has the potential to be like the teams that made the playoffs in 97 and 98 if they buy into Boucher's system.  Something that press has suggested the team didn't do last year thanks to Karlsson and now that distraction is gone.

The defence on paper is scary but Jacques got a lot out of mediocre D and two way depth forwards I believe Boucher is a similar coach.  Ultimately, it'll be up to the coach to win over the room and hope Anderson has a couple of years left.

There's no way Karlsson was a part of the problem. Especially when our goalies were so shite and players lile Ryan continue to underperform
I have no proof to say he was and if I had to guess I'd just say his talent made him worth any issues he may cause.  That said there has been speculation on him being a bit of a bitch over the years and that may have caused problems for some of our past coaches.  Brennan commented on a misunderstanding with Karlsson years ago and when Brennan tried to talk to him to clarify Karlsson refused to speak to him on it and another player chalked that up to Karlssn being his usual stubborn self.  Then I remember Hoffman saying the same thing.  He tried to talk to Karlsson and explain and Karlsson just dismissed him.  Even now Hoffman's partner is trying to get help from the court to clear her name.  You'd think if a couple were that adamant of their innocence you'd give up your "evidence" with an interest in settling who did it.  Hoffman's girlfriend has been judged guilty without giving her any opportunity to defend herself.

Now take that entitled little bitch attitude of Karlsson akd imagine what it must be like for coach's like MacLean and Boucher dealing with this guy in the locker room trying not to get his fees fees hurt because they sure won't be able to win him over once he presses the stubborn button.

Bottom line for his talent we should want him here for his whole career but there could be some positives from his absence and maybe he doesn't have the right character to build a championship around.

I'm frankly more pissed at all the other crap Dorion has pulled, losing Methot, giving up Turris and Phaneuf and so on.
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#54
(2018-09-15, 12:44 AM)Rinkrat Wrote: I have no proof to say he was and if I had to guess I'd just say his talent made him worth any issues he may cause.  That said there has been speculation on him being a bit of a bitch over the years and that may have caused problems for some of our past coaches.  Brennan commented on a misunderstanding with Karlsson years ago and when Brennan tried to talk to him to clarify Karlsson refused to speak to him on it and another player chalked that up to Karlssn being his usual stubborn self.  Then I remember Hoffman saying the same thing.  He tried to talk to Karlsson and explain and Karlsson just dismissed him.  Even now Hoffman's partner is trying to get help from the court to clear her name.  You'd think if a couple were that adamant of their innocence you'd give up your "evidence" with an interest in settling who did it.  Hoffman's girlfriend has been judged guilty without giving her any opportunity to defend herself.

Now take that entitled little bitch attitude of Karlsson akd imagine what it must be like for coach's like MacLean and Boucher dealing with this guy in the locker room trying not to get his fees fees hurt because they sure won't be able to win him over once he presses the stubborn button.

Bottom line for his talent we should want him here for his whole career but there could be some positives from his absence and maybe he doesn't have the right character to build a championship around.

I'm frankly more pissed at all the other crap Dorion has pulled, losing Methot, giving up Turris and Phaneuf and so on.

The crap that Dorion has pulled, you mean Melnyk has pulled?

I know Dorion said that he makes the hockey decisions, but at this point, you really buy that? The problems starts from 1 guy (NOT karlsson).

#MelnykGTFO - I'm just waiting to see if he cleans up his act (a really big if) while still hoping he id forced to sell ASAP. Until either 1 of the 2 things happen, I'll be damned to spend my money on this team.
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#55
It's highly likely Melnyk is involved but like you said Dorion is claiming the decisions are his. I'd like to see them both gone tbh.
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#56
Hopinh Demelo can emerge as a reliable top 4 guy
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#57
Driving my daughter to practice this morning and noticed someone had dumped all their Sens gear on the side of the road lol.
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#58
(2018-09-15, 11:55 AM)bicboi Wrote: Hopinh Demelo can emerge as a reliable top 4 guy

Sure, Could happen, but then you have to think what would happen if he gets good and when the ELC expires, what happens?

The model Melnyk is likely going for is to rely on draft picks and hope they pan out before having to sign them to big contracts, then trade them away when that happens.

This is minimal spending until cashing out with expansion and lebreton, or they actually pan out with the gamble.

So this team's future is now between Melnyk leaving (finally, we have new owner and new hope), and gambling with picks and prospects (I don't care about how cheap the guy is, as long as the team wins).
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#59
I reckon Demelo or any other player that emerges will be jerked around on short bridge deals and arbitration hearings the way Stone is currently getting. Hopefully Stone's work ethic rubs off on the rest of the team. This is his team and he's the leader now
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#60
(2018-09-15, 01:18 PM)bicboi Wrote: I reckon Demelo or any other player that emerges will be jerked around on short bridge deals and arbitration hearings the way Stone is currently getting. Hopefully Stone's work ethic rubs off on the rest of the team. This is his team and he's the leader now

Knowing this team having to roll the dice more than other teams does not do well for building hope.
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