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What kind of scumbag does this?
#61
(2018-03-13, 09:39 AM)Bandit Wrote:
(2018-03-12, 10:49 PM)Fritz Wrote: My girlfriend is afraid of dogs, she'll cross the street to avoid them if she can, and I can tell you it will cause her stress to have to eat next to one in a restaurant, no matter how irrational that may seem to you.

You have such a bias towards animals that you will completely disregard the rights of someone that has a legitimate fear of them.

The only animal that belongs in a restaurant is the one that is grilled and on my plate.

K, my wife has an extreme phobia to dogs, and I mean extreme!  She will literally either freeze up or scream hysterically and cry in the presence of a dog that is not well behaved (ie. jumping up and down etc.).

For this reason, I could give a rats arse what the dog does for your anxiety, it creates anxiety for my wife and, in the instance that your beloved puppy is ill behaved in public, I am likely to say something and tell you to get your dog the "f" away from her.  If you do not have it leashed, I'm likely to boot "f" the dog regardless of how passionately you tell me "it's friendly".

It comes down to ownership!  If your dog is ill behaved and not well socialized and trained, keep it the "f" away from the public!!

For sure humans are more important than dogs or cats even thought there are lots of folks who think they are, but this is about service animals, the ones I have seen are always very quiet and well behaved. They don't jump, bark or ever leave the side of their owner. I have never seen a puppy as a service dog either.
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#62
Hamster flushed down toilet after college student’s pet denied flight on Spirit Airlines

https://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/airpla...ed-n846116

A beloved pet hamster that was flushed down a toilet has become the latest controversial case in airlines versus people seeking to travel with emotional support animals.

Belen Aldecosea, 21, on Thursday accused Spirit Airlines of causing her to tearfully flush Pebbles the hamster down a toilet in an airport bathroom after the company refused to let her bring the pet on a flight as an emotional support animal, according to lawyer Adam Goodman.

Aldecosea made the choice after Spirit staffers allegedly told her before her trip that she could bring her pet and later refused to let the animal on her flight at Baltimore–Washington International Airport on Nov. 21, Goodman said.

“This is a horrible situation. We hope that no one ever has to go through a situation like this,” he told NBC News Thursday. “This is a really tiny, small innocuous animal that doesn’t cause problems. Really, the airlines and TSA shouldn’t have given her any problems about it if she had the appropriate medical documentation.”

Goodman said that Aldecosea was told by phone by an airline employee that she could fly with Pebbles as an emotional support animal, but then would not let her on the flight with her hamster.

Aldecosea is alleging that an airline representative then suggested she flush the animal down a toilet, according to Goodman. The college student had some ongoing medical issues and needed to catch a flight home to Florida, he said. Aldecosea had a benign, but painful growth on her neck and was traveling to Florida because she was withdrawing from school and having the growth looked at by a doctor, he said.

She was a student at Wilson College in Pennsylvania at the time and is now a student in Texas, he said.

She tried to find alternate modes of travel, but Aldecosea is too young to rent a car on her own and there was a lack of other options because of the Thanksgiving holiday, Goodman said, leaving the young woman with a “horrendous” decision to make.

“Spirit told her what to do. She thought she was following the rules,” he said. “Ultimately, the airline didn’t provide what they said they were going to provide for her.”

Spirit Airlines strongly denied the allegation that an employee suggested she flush the hamster.

“After researching this incident, we can say confidently that at no point did any of our agents suggest this Guest (or any other for that matter) should flush or otherwise injure an animal,” airline spokesman Derek Dombrowski said in a statement to NBC News.

“It is incredibly disheartening to hear this Guest reportedly decided to end her own pet’s life,” the statement added.

Related: Emotional support peacock denied flight by United Airlines

Spirit's spokesman said that a reservation representative “unfortunately, did misinform the Guest that a hamster was permitted to fly as an emotional support animal on Spirit Airlines.”

The airline said when Aldecosea showed up to the airport with the hamster agents gave her the opportunity to take a later flight “so she had time to find other accommodations for the animal.”

Spirit Airlines says on its website that it "does not accept snakes, other reptiles, rodents, ferrets, and spiders."

Dombrowski said Aldecosea was originally scheduled to take a 10:39 a.m. flight on Nov. 21 but ended up taking a flight at 7:42 p.m. instead.

Aldecosea took the later flight without further incident, he said. Dombrowski added that the airline offered Aldecosea a voucher, but never heard back from her.

Goodman said he and Aldecosea were “going to look into all legal remedies and make a decision.”

Aldecosea told the Miami Herald that the whole ordeal was "horrifying."

“I was emotional. I was crying. I sat there for a good 10 minutes crying in the stall," she said.

Related: Delta sets new guidelines on service animals allowed on board

The hamster incident came after a separate airline turned away an emotional support peacock at a New Jersey airport last month. United Airlines said the bird did not meet its guidelines.

Also in January, Delta Airlines issued new requirements when it comes to emotional support animals.

The Department of Transportation's guidelines for air travel with service animals states "unusual animals are evaluated on a case by case basis" and that airlines may exclude animals that are too large or heavy to accommodate in the flight cabin, pose a direct threat to the health or safety of others, could cause a significant disruption of service or are prohibited from entering a foreign country.

Airlines are also never required to accept snakes, reptiles, rodents, ferrets, or spiders.
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#63
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-42880690

A female traveller was recently banned from taking a large "emotional-support peacock" on board a United Airlines flight, it has emerged.
She had offered to buy the bird its own plane ticket, according to travel blog Live and Let Fly.
Nonetheless the airline refused to let the bird board at Newark airport in New Jersey, saying it did not meet guidelines due to its weight and size.
United says this was explained to the traveller before she arrived at Newark.
Pictures of the striking bird and its owner, attempting to travel to Los Angeles, emerged via The Jet Set, a travel-based talk show.
The images show the animal perched on an airport baggage trolley, as fellow passengers gaze at it in shock.
After six hours at the airport, the exotic bird and its human companions decided to take to the road and instead drive across the US. Bought for art
The peacock, reportedly called Dexter, belongs to Brooklyn-based artist Ventiko, who documents its life on social media.
"I have never left the house without having at least one person react," Ventiko told a local culture website in 2017.
The artist, whose real name is not known, told Bedford and Bowery that the feathery giant "really changed my life in a positive way".
[Image: _99818375_dd306ab2-9b6d-4178-9a70-88cd5066e828.jpg]Image copyrightPICTURE VIA THEJETSET.TVImage captionUnited Airlines said the bird did not meet size guidelines. It is not known if the woman pictured is its owner[Image: _97415642_007_in_numbers_624.png]
She originally bought Dexter and a peahen called Etta for an art installation. She later found them a new home from which Etta and her offspring disappeared.
The loss affected Dexter's behaviour and Ventiko came to his rescue after hearing that the bird was housed in a garage. Following a failed stint at an upstate New York farm, Ventiko finally decided to welcome Dexter into her Bushwick loft.
Now involved in her photography and performance art, the exotic bird appears to enjoy his New York life.
However, he avoids public transportation, like the subway, because Ventiko doesn't "want to traumatise him".
Animals in the air
Airlines have allowed some passengers with emotional or psychiatric problems to take therapy animals on board with them.
But the number of emotional support animals has been rising in recent years, sparking suggestions that people are abusing the system.
In 2014, a woman was escorted off a US Airways flight when her pig, named Hobie, defecated and squealed before the plane took off.
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#64
(2018-03-13, 09:53 AM)Mavid Wrote:
(2018-03-13, 09:39 AM)Bandit Wrote:
(2018-03-12, 10:49 PM)Fritz Wrote: My girlfriend is afraid of dogs, she'll cross the street to avoid them if she can, and I can tell you it will cause her stress to have to eat next to one in a restaurant, no matter how irrational that may seem to you.

You have such a bias towards animals that you will completely disregard the rights of someone that has a legitimate fear of them.

The only animal that belongs in a restaurant is the one that is grilled and on my plate.

K, my wife has an extreme phobia to dogs, and I mean extreme!  She will literally either freeze up or scream hysterically and cry in the presence of a dog that is not well behaved (ie. jumping up and down etc.).

For this reason, I could give a rats arse what the dog does for your anxiety, it creates anxiety for my wife and, in the instance that your beloved puppy is ill behaved in public, I am likely to say something and tell you to get your dog the "f" away from her.  If you do not have it leashed, I'm likely to boot "f" the dog regardless of how passionately you tell me "it's friendly".

It comes down to ownership!  If your dog is ill behaved and not well socialized and trained, keep it the "f" away from the public!!

For sure humans are more important than dogs or cats even thought there are lots of folks who think they are, but this is about service animals, the ones I have seen are always very quiet and well behaved. They don't jump, bark or ever leave the side of their owner. I have never seen a puppy as a service dog either.

My girlfriend was attacked by a dog when she was young, and like Bandit has a legit phobia for them.

We see a big, dumb, happy dog smiling beside its owner, she sees it as a snarling and vicious beast.  It's a phobia, and probably not an uncommon one.

I have no issue with service dogs, but these emotional support animals don't really require special training, and it is a system that will be abused.  Doctors will be giving out all kinds of notes to make these stupid pets "special" so that entitled people can take their furry friends anywhere with them. It's bullshit.
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#65
This is Bailey.  He's my Emotional Support Grizzly Bear.  I take him everywhere.  Yeah, once in a while he gets mad and eats a person, but he helps me with my anxiety.

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRKSrkJrNXljRvPg9LUV-r...27AT0kqtAg]
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#66
(2018-03-13, 07:44 AM)bicboi Wrote: Medical necessity for people that need service animals for anxiety aren't that straight forward.

Well it ought to be. The key word is necessity. In the workplace accommodation world that I have expertise in, there must be a distinction made between a preference and a medical necessity.

You may feel more comfortable going into a restaurant when your dog is with you, but unless your condition is so debilitating that you can not go to a restaurant, or fly, or take a train without one, you should not be allowed to impinge on the rights of others in that space simply because it makes you feel better.

You keep characterizing these animals as being well behaved and harmless while having been given many examples where their presence diminishes the experience of others, regardless of their behaviour.

There should be a rigid set of parameters that guide whether a doctor may provide sanction for emotional support animals to be used in the above context.
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#67
(2018-03-13, 11:38 AM)Fritz Wrote:
(2018-03-13, 09:53 AM)Mavid Wrote:
(2018-03-13, 09:39 AM)Bandit Wrote:
(2018-03-12, 10:49 PM)Fritz Wrote: My girlfriend is afraid of dogs, she'll cross the street to avoid them if she can, and I can tell you it will cause her stress to have to eat next to one in a restaurant, no matter how irrational that may seem to you.

You have such a bias towards animals that you will completely disregard the rights of someone that has a legitimate fear of them.

The only animal that belongs in a restaurant is the one that is grilled and on my plate.

K, my wife has an extreme phobia to dogs, and I mean extreme!  She will literally either freeze up or scream hysterically and cry in the presence of a dog that is not well behaved (ie. jumping up and down etc.).

For this reason, I could give a rats arse what the dog does for your anxiety, it creates anxiety for my wife and, in the instance that your beloved puppy is ill behaved in public, I am likely to say something and tell you to get your dog the "f" away from her.  If you do not have it leashed, I'm likely to boot "f" the dog regardless of how passionately you tell me "it's friendly".

It comes down to ownership!  If your dog is ill behaved and not well socialized and trained, keep it the "f" away from the public!!

For sure humans are more important than dogs or cats even thought there are lots of folks who think they are, but this is about service animals, the ones I have seen are always very quiet and well behaved. They don't jump, bark or ever leave the side of their owner. I have never seen a puppy as a service dog either.

My girlfriend was attacked by a dog when she was young, and like Bandit has a legit phobia for them.

We see a big, dumb, happy dog smiling beside its owner, she sees it as a snarling and vicious beast.  It's a phobia, and probably not an uncommon one.

I have no issue with service dogs, but these emotional support animals don't really require special training, and it is a system that will be abused.  Doctors will be giving out all kinds of notes to make these stupid pets "special" so that entitled people can take their furry friends anywhere with them. It's bullshit.
The way I read it, sounded like Bandit was talking about service dogs only which are not puppies or ill behaved dogs . Sorry if I miss read I agree with you animals don't need to go everywhere the owner does, with of course the exception of service dogs. In Ottawa they are talking about letting them on bus's. It seems that the dog zealots don't care about people with severe allergies, or fears..their little "fur babies" trump the paying human.
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Weed Wacker – and Flamethrower Grandma Smurf


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#68
(2018-03-13, 11:42 AM)25YearRebuild Wrote: This is Bailey.  He's my Emotional Support Grizzly Bear.  I take him everywhere.  Yeah, once in a while he gets mad and eats a person, but he helps me with my anxiety.

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRKSrkJrNXljRvPg9LUV-r...27AT0kqtAg]

Icon_razz  ooooh I like Bailey I may need to borrow him you know to go for a walk
º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤
Weed Wacker – and Flamethrower Grandma Smurf


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#69
Bandit appears to be talking about emotional support dogs for people with anxiety.  As far as I know, to be designated an emotional support animal, the animal doesn't require special training, and that is why this designation can include cats, pigs, hamsters, grizzly bears, ect... You just need a doctor to say the animal provides therapeutic benefits to the owner.
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#70
keep the animals at home and smoke a fatty, then use Doritos as your support snack.
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#71
(2018-03-13, 11:47 AM)Limestoner Wrote:
(2018-03-13, 07:44 AM)bicboi Wrote: Medical necessity for people that need service animals for anxiety aren't that straight forward.

Well it ought to be. The key word is necessity. In the workplace accommodation world that I have expertise in, there must be a distinction made between a preference and a medical necessity.

You may feel more comfortable going into a restaurant when your dog is with you, but unless your condition is so debilitating that you can not go to a restaurant, or fly, or take a train without one, you should not be allowed to impinge on the rights of others in that space simply because it makes you feel better.

You keep characterizing these animals as being well behaved and harmless while having been given many examples where their presence diminishes the experience of others, regardless of their behaviour.

There should be a rigid set of parameters that guide whether a doctor may provide sanction for emotional support animals to be used in the above context.

I'm in support for more rigid guidelines. But the examples brought forth by others have severe flaws. If someone is afraid of dogs, is that fear debilitating or can it be mitigated by having either individual sit at different parts of a restaurant or walk on different ends of a street.

I'm arguing that these ESA animals meet the requirements that a workplace would have in terms of someone being unable to function properly. I'm in full support for their being a process tomeaduto this. The concerns in this thread are that it's currently fraudulent, which I diont disagree with. Its super asy to undermine and take adavadvange of and that is what needs to be addressed. Both through the law and the process to certify an animal as an esa.
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#72
(2018-03-13, 12:01 PM)Fritz Wrote: Bandit appears to be talking about emotional support dogs for people with anxiety.  As far as I know, to be designated an emotional support animal, the animal doesn't require special training, and that is why this designation can include cats, pigs, hamsters, grizzly bears, ect... You just need a doctor to say the animal provides therapeutic benefits to the owner.

Doctors do a good job in determining if a person has difficulty functioning with or without an animal given they usually coordinate with mental health specialists. But you're absolutely right and the vagueness of it needs to be addressed, this is where the law has to determine some standards,nnot outright ban all animals as ESA like others are suggesting
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#73
Have you ever ridden a bus with a dog on it? I have, you see several of them in Ottawa especially in the downtown area because thats where a lot of mental health services are situated for young people. 

These aren't dog zealots, these are practical people who want people with mental health issues getting the help they deserve regardless of if they use a crutch or a dog to get to that service. 

If there was a fear of allergies, there would be data to suggest that it's actually problem rather than people just dfea mongering. Breeders have already responded to this by mixing several breeds with hypoallergenic dogs to address the allergy issue.
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#74
(2018-03-13, 11:42 AM)25YearRebuild Wrote: This is Bailey.  He's my Emotional Support Grizzly Bear.  I take him everywhere.  Yeah, once in a while he gets mad and eats a person, but he helps me with my anxiety.

[Image: images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRKSrkJrNXljRvPg9LUV-r...27AT0kqtAg]

Love it!!!!  In some people with a phobias mind, there is no difference between this and a dog!
A leader without followers is just a person taking a walk...
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#75
(2018-03-13, 12:01 PM)Fritz Wrote: Bandit appears to be talking about emotional support dogs for people with anxiety.  As far as I know, to be designated an emotional support animal, the animal doesn't require special training, and that is why this designation can include cats, pigs, hamsters, grizzly bears, ect... You just need a doctor to say the animal provides therapeutic benefits to the owner.

I am in no way talking about actual support or care dogs who have been trained to serve their owners.  These are so well trained, they would pass by my wife without giving her a second look.  I might step between her and the dog as we pass but she can generally handle that.

It is the unruly, unleashed pets that send her into hysterics.

Now, if EVERY emotional support animal had the training and behavioral patterns as a full care animal... probably no problem.
A leader without followers is just a person taking a walk...
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#76
(2018-03-13, 12:10 PM)bicboi Wrote: Doctors do a good job in determining if a person has difficulty functioning with or without an animal given they usually coordinate with mental health specialists. But you're absolutely right and the vagueness of it needs to be addressed, this is where the law has to determine some standards,nnot outright ban all animals as ESA like others are suggesting

That's not entirely true. If a person says they have anxiety and their pet helps with it, the doctor will usually provide a note. Cast do this all the time on flights between/within Canada and the US. To be honest, it for some reason I needed to travel with my pet and they were well behaved, I'd go this route too. The cargo cabin they keep pets in must be a nightmare to the animal. 

As an aside, 25 - you didn't strike me a "bear" man.
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#77
https://www.healthline.com/health/servic...ervice-dog

Can a Service Dog Help with Your Anxiety?
Psychiatric service dogs
Getting a service dog
Coping
Takeaway
What are service dogs?
Service dogs act as companions and aides to people who have a disability. Traditionally, this has included people with visual impairment, hearing impairments, or mobility impairments. Many people are familiar with this type of service animal.

These dogs can also assist people who have a condition that isn’t visible, such as diabetes. This is also true of mental health conditions, such as post-traumatic stress disorder, depression, and anxiety.

Service dogs differ from regular pets. To be legally recognized as a service animal, these dogs are trained to perform tasks that can help someone with a disability. Depending on the person’s needs, this can mean anything from bringing a person their medication during times of crisis to finding help during a medical emergency.

PSYCHIATRIC SERVICE DOGS
What are psychiatric service dogs?

Just like “standard” service dogs, psychiatric service dogs are trained to help a person accomplish necessary tasks and protect them from harm. Psychiatric service dogs typically assist people who have mental health conditions that interfere with their day-to-day lives.

[b]A psychiatric service dog may help someone with anxiety by:

bringing medication, or water to help swallow medication, during an anxiety attack
bringing a phone over during an anxiety attack, which you can use to call your therapist or other support system
leading someone to you if you’re in crisis
providing tactile stimulation, such as licking your face, to help disrupt an emotional overload
providing pressure against your chest or abdomen to create a calming effect during moments of distress
[/b]
Sometimes, people mistake emotional support dogs for psychiatric service dogs. An emotional support animal simply provides the owner with a therapeutic presence. These animals aren’t trained to perform any tasks. This is because their presence is meant to mitigate any psychological or emotional symptoms you may be experiencing.

GETTING A SERVICE DOG
How to get a service dog

You must meet several criteria to be eligible for a service dog. This may include:

having a physical disability or debilitating illness or disorder
being able to participate in the dog’s training process
being able to independently command and care for a service dog
having a stable home environment

Service dogs are trained to meet a person’s needs before they’re placed in someone’s home. A dog that has already served as a pet usually can’t be trained later as service dog.

To apply for a psychiatric service dog, you will need a recommendation from a medical doctor or licensed mental health professional.

About 18 percent of American adults experience some form of mental health disorder. Overall, about 4 percent of American adults experience a severe or debilitating mental health disorder. This means that only a fraction of people who have a mental health disorder are qualified for a psychiatric service dog.

People who have anxiety that isn’t as debilitating may benefit from an emotional support animal. These domestic animals aren’t limited to canines. They’re intended to provide comforting companionship.

Emotional support animals are still regarded as pets in most situations. This means they don’t have the same legal protections as service animals in public and private spaces. These animals are afforded a few of the same provisions, though. A person with an emotional support animal is still qualified for no-pet housing and may fly with the animal without paying an extra fee.

People who believe they will benefit from an emotional support animal also need a prescription letter from a mental health professional.

COPING
What are other ways to cope with anxiety?
Coping with anxiety varies from person to person, so it’s important to find what works for you. What you may need depends on how you’re feeling and what’s triggering your anxiety.

Some general tips include:

going for a walk
practicing mindfulness
performing breathing exercises
getting a full night’s sleep
exercising regularly
If you need help, reach out to your therapist or a mental health professional. If you don’t have one, the National Alliance on Mental Illness offers tips for how to find the right therapist or doctor for you. The organization also offers help in finding someone in your area. This can be done online or by calling 800-950-NAMI.

If you need immediate medical attention, you should call your local emergency services.

TAKEAWAY
What you can do now
If you think that you would benefit from a service dog or emotional support animal, you should reach out to a therapist or another mental health professional. They can work with you to determine whether a service dog or emotional support animal is the best fit for you.
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#78
(2018-03-12, 01:21 AM)Ryu65 Wrote: If I was in charge of law-making, anyone caught doing this would have their dog put down immediately.....then let's see who does it again.

I'll go as far as taking their dog away from them but to kill the dog. Come one now.
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#79
On a somewhat related note, a dog died on a United Airline flight after a flight attendant made the owner put the dog in the overhead storage compartment.

The dog was in a small carrier designed to fit under an airline seat but they are saying it was partially blocking the aisle.

United has taken full responsibility for the death admitting fault.
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